N-I'm Naoma Dye

C- So, Naoma tell us a little bit about yourself.

N-Well, I'm 31yrs old, I'm African American, I was raised by my grandparents. As a little child coming up, I was the only child, and I was very spoiled, I got everything that I wanted, but I didn't get my mother's love like I wanted it. I could remember my grandmother would take out a lot of time for me, to come home from work on lunch breaks to be with me.

C-Where are you from?

N- I'm from Chicago.

C-And who raised you?

N-My grandparents did. We lived out in Tinley Park up until the age of seven then we resided in the south side till I graduated from 8th grade. That's when my mother started coming into my life. Trying to show her presence, but it didn't work. She couldn't stay focused on being a mother I guess.

C-Why?

N- Because today I know because of her drug use. Back then I didn't know because I was a child I didn't understand. I just wanted her to be there and it didn't matter. 8th grade graduation I was decked out, they had hooked me up, they spent so much money on me, she did that. But when I was singing looking into the audience there wasn't anyone there, that really hurt me, it basically devastated me. By this time my grandmother had passed on, I was left to move with my mom. And even though my grandmother and grandfather had paid the home, she just let it go, with all the money my grandmother had left it was just gone. Not even months I would say a month it was all gone. My grandfather had a building on the west side of Chicago, that's where we moved to, and I just thought of raising myself basically. I would still travel south to go to high school. Which was Julian Percey on 103rd. But I started getting to a point where I start looking for love and men. Individuals, I start looking for that, about fifteen, no ten I was sexually active and by he age of fifteen I was pregnant and in a abusive relationship-very abusive. I suffered from domestic violence at this time even though i was staying with my mom. She didn't have much to say about what I did. The man thing was that by this time to abort the baby, I think I was five months pregnant, the doctor had told her of how high of a risk I would be, she was going to fly me over here. So I took it upon myself to runaway from home.

C- Digress a little bit, so you said that you were sexually active at the age of ten? Tell us about that.

N-At this time at ten I was sent away with an aunt. On the block it was like there was a lot of little girls. I honestly believed today, this is my stuff, the way that I looked and with all I had I didn't fit in. Even though I didn't have the love from my mother, I was very cute growing up. Iwas very spoiled, I had everything all the little kids wanted. Even my own family members they would try to pick fights with me. So I shyed away from my family members, and I turned to boys, hanging out with groups and started to drink- practiced that. No one else will be doing it and hugged up and kissing but me.

C- So you were a beautiful girl? And the beauty did it help you or didn't?

N- It didn't help me.

C- Did you like it?

N- I started disliking it I started disliking the way my body was figured out, the attention that I would draw, and I wasn't comfortable with all the attention I drew-the old men whatever.

C- Did people ask you about your race?

N- Yes still today I'm Mexican and Puerto Rican, they don't believe me if I tell them I'm African American. And really I don't know because my moms was adopted.

C- So the color of your eyes and all that?

N- I don't know where that comes from, my moms was adopted.

C- So at ten years old you were sexually active.

N- I was sexually active but still going to school. When it happened I was so scared, I jumped up, I wasn't feeling right, and I ran home and I cried, and I never did it again till I was fifteen, and that's when I got pregnant. And like I was saying when I became pregnant my mother found out, and it was too late, and I did runaway from home. This guy that I was pregnant by he was so abusive and he use to tell me things like. And because my self-esteem was longing for him, for this type of relationship I would accept it, nobody is going to want me, I'm ugly, I'm fat. Whose going to want you, your not going to be able to accomplish anything in life. And with the absence of my mother giving me this information, this knowledge, and guiding me in the right way-this stuck with me and I believed that for many many years.

N- After I was able to remove myself, I even got this other guy to beat him up, I promised him that would marry him, he engaged me and everything, we got a ring, I told him that I didn't want to marry him-because I didn't. it was all a cycle to get out one thing and to get into something else. I don't know.

C- So at fifteen you had your abortion or miscarriage?

N- No, I had my daughter she's fifteen today her name is Karina. And at this age I wasn't trying to take care of no baby, and I had started becoming involved in alcohol and heavily fighting, and trying to be in the gangs and trying to fit in. So her grandmother on her father's side came to me, and I was standing on the porch. And said let me take Karina I'm not going to try to keep her from you, I just want to help, you can come and stay with me, I understand about your mom. She knew more about my mom than I did at that point. So she was really open about taking us in, which I did for a while. But I went on in there to progressing in my addiction.

C- When did you start using drugs?

N- I started alcohol at the age of 13, I started using heavy drugs at 17, by this time I had went from drinking alcohol, to smoking PCP, to smoking marijuana, to heroine. And once I hit heroine I left all the other drugs. I used heroine up until my last incarceration in 1994. That was something hard for me.

C- Tell me about it what did you do?

N- To get my drugs?

C- Were you a lady of the street?

N- A lady of the street does not just have to be on the street. You can be what you got, laying up in the bed, "I need some money." It's not just street prostitution. I've done the streets before, I've walked not just went out there to do prostitutionm, but if some guys pulled up to me yes I've done that. I went in stores and stole merchandise, I've sold drugs on the street corners. I've been one of those pull over to the park and how many do you want-by any means necessary to get my drugs. Because heroine had became physical for me. I would wake up crying or sick if I didn't have the drug. I would try and go away with my father, whom at the age of fifteen I found out he wasn't my father, so all them years too there was more stuff. I thought he was my dad, but my mother had hid letters from me, from my real father writing me. And still today I don't know because she says he's not my father, she says that he was incarcerated. That devastated me as well cause I'm thinking this is my father since I was a baby, and you telling me he's not even though I still treated him the same, a part of me going through my addiction I went out to his house and try to kick or whatever.

C- Kick what does that mean?

N- To go without drugs, to detox myself. Just trying to stop. He had this basement and it was like he was trying to lock me up in there and not let me come back. Because I got to a point where I can't do it, and he had so much faith in me and wanted me so bad to not get high, and not come back it was that this time I had a warrant out for my arrest. And he knew that if I came back to Chicago that I was going to get arrested, but I didn't care. So we squabble and went around, went to the hospital and that didn't work, then he put me in the basement that didn't work. So the next morning I got up and told him I'm walking if you don't take me to the train station, I'm walking. And that's what I did, he ended up taking me. So I came back to Chicago.

C- How old were you?

N- By this time I'm at the age of I skipped a bit. I'm at the age of 26, I was about 26. And it had gotten so bad I hadn't seen my girls, I was just calling I'll be over there next weekend, weeks and weeks had turned into months and months. I think the shame and the guilt I just didn't want them to see me like that. Let me skip back some, and even though I had had Karina at the age of fifteen I have another daughter named Diamond. And I had Diamond by another man. When she was born she was tested positive for heroine. They wasn't going to try to take her away from me, but they wanted to monitor her, and monitor me coming in. I would come in there just as if I was on the street. I would come in there drunk, rocking and hugging her, kissing on her. Still they released her to me. And it was one day I was out of the apartment my girlfriend was sitting there and I hadn't had my morning bag. So I was like hold my baby I'll be back, now I really didn't know this lady to leave Diamond with her. I did that and my aunt came along and she seen Diamond and came looking for me. She got Diamond and she took her to Karina's grandmothers house, and since then she took her in and hadn't treated her any different. Really Diamond is the spoiled brat that's her baby because she doesn't want her to feel any different. So she went to Court for Diamond when I was incarcerated, she tried to get full custody, so she wouldn't go in the system. So we subsidized guardianship, when I'm able to get my own housing, so I could present myself for the court and tell the judge this is what I'm doing, I want my kids back. You know give me chance. That's where that situation is at, so both of my girls are together, Diamond is not Ms. Williams faternal granddaughter but she treats her just the same. I go over there basically Diamond is always up under her. She loves Diamond there is no difference.

Salome- Can you describe how it feels to be addictive and not to have it.

N-It's undescribable I was so sick, I would regurgitate, I would sweat, I would have diarrhea and sweat and vomit at the same time. I would have this body odor, it was just horrible.

C- Describe the physical she means physically compare it to the flu..

N- It was worst than the flu, for me it was.

C- Like having a baby you had cramps.

N- Cramps, headaches, just everything at one time. I couldn't function, my bones everything, I just could not function. And it was amazing that when I got that first hit I would straighten right up everything would just go. No more pain, no more diarrhea, no nothing.

C- Tell us about the sexual abuse.

N-Sexual abuse. Well I've never been abused sexually by any of my family members, but have been sexually abused when I was in a domestic violence relationship. Today I know that no means no, but then it was like you mean yes and turn over whenever he was beating me. He wanted to make up that that was his way, that was his sick thinking that he was making up, get in the bed, turn over. And he tried anal sex but it didn't happen, I got another black eye for that whatever. Family abuse, sexual abuse no, I had a family member that tried to sexually abuse me, came out the bathroom with his penis in his hand, and I took off running. I think by the grace of God he didn't catch me, that didn't happen. Sexual abuse and domestic violence is the same, it hurts, I didn't want it, I said no.

Sal- What was the circumstance for the first sexual experience when you were ten?

N- What was the circumstance? It was in a basement.

C- How did it come about?

N- How did it come about? It was the guy next door, and he was an older guy, and he would come and whisper something in my ear and we would start talking and plan, "You got to come over my house one day", and I said, "I am." And we started calling and I told him what time to call so my aunt wouldn't know. So we started getting real acquainted and I went over there one day. And it wasn't in a bedroom or anything it was in a dark basement, a dark, dirty, dingy basement. And it happened pretty quick, and I bled so hard, that's what scared me, that's what scared me for four years. It didn't scared me long. That's what scared me I jumped up and I ran home, and I was washing it off and I was crying. And I remembered saying something on the phone, I was talking to somebody, my cousin got on the phone and she knew and she said, "Sherry got her cherry busted." Sherry is what my family calls me even though my first name is Naoma. Everyone calls me Sherry that's my middle name. And she was like Cherry got her cherry busted and I was so embarrassed, so humiliated, because she had got on the phone. Whoever I was talking to, I hurried up and hung up the phone. And she knew but she never told my aunt, my mother never took me to get checked out at the doctor or nothing like that to try and figure if I was sexually active or not. She would just come and get me and punish me over something my auntie said. Because I remember one time I even lied because I had got caught, not being sexually active but I was up there fondling and the little foam had got in my hair. My hair was up and it was bad, by the time my auntie called me, and by the time I come outside I had foam and stuff. And my auntie was like what you been doing up there, and whipped me with a shoe. So I lied on the boy down the street, that he was threatening me and he was trying to get�right now today I never told him that and I'm sorry. That's what I did I had my mother go down there, my aunt, and they was going to go as far as the police because I was scared. Even though I wasn't doing anything I was scared.

C- When was the first time you had a problem with the police?

N- I have a rap sheet so long.

C- What's a rap sheet?

N- A rap sheet is, I have a print out for my own purposes, it's just basically a reminder for me, it's a everything and every crime or every time incarcerated, just going to the prison, down to county jail, everything you've been charged for. It's just a record of your criminal history.

C- So when did your criminal history start?

N- Somewhere maybe around 1989.

C- And it was for?

N- It was drugs, it was drugs.

C- Tell us about your incarceration.

N- Basically I was one of those that would go in one day or one week, and go right back the next.

C- So this was the county?

N- Mmm Hmm. I would go through lock up and get out, because at first I was rolling with them, they would let me out, I get I-bonds and probation, and I would violate the probation.

C- And this is for selling drugs or using?

N- because of using I would sell, then it might change to retail theft, by this time I was on intensive probation. I had gotten from probation to intensive probation, and he was like, he come back in front of me, we got a new case we just going to help you out I give you two years.

C- So basically two year in the Illinois Dept. of Corrections.

N- So I'm in the county and while I'm in there, when I first start going it was all new to me, I was scared. I've always been a loner really but I've always tried to fit in. I would sit off to myself and call home a lot. Wait on commissary, commissary is when you can go out and buy cigarettes or candy or something.

C- Did you get any help?

N- At first I was getting help. At first I was getting help and support from my family.

C- I mean from the jail?

N- The jail?! No.

C- Cause you had a drug problem.

N- Oh no, I could remember one time I was so sick I fell out in front of the nurse, they just scoop you up and tell you to sit up, and give you some old green stuff call Reukatine A, I would never forget it. Well, one time I went into the county I was so sick, they was so devastated I don't know if I turned blue or purple. When I woke up I was on the outside of the outside hospital, and I had a visitor at the end of my bed, and I didn't even know how I got there or what I was even doing there. And this was my visiting day in the county, and he was telling me, "You're going to make it shorty." That's what he used to call me, "You're going to be ok, you got to pull yourself together." I was just so weak, I was just drained, my whole body was aching, and I just wanted it to be over. It was just a feeling that you can never forget.

C- So you basically in county jail three or four times, the judge finally sent you to the prison you got two years, so you going down. How old were you?

N- 23 or 24 with these two years you do six months, I went to Dwight, I went on shipment, I was very scared gong on shipment. Put you on the bus, shackle you up, sit you down, and talk to you real nasty. And once arriving to Dwight I was even more scared. It was like what's behind the wall is unknown, and they stripped us and talk to you however. And some girl is trying to smuggle in cigarettes, it was just a scary experience for me. Not even before two weeks I was going off Dixon, and Dixon was a coed facility, and to me it was more of a privilege to go to Dixon or Logan, and I was happy to be going to one of those places. So I went up to a cell where there was like eight other women, and it was very uncomfortable still but it was less tension, it was less tension, it wasn't like they were right up on you, or you would pop the door open and you would walk into a guard's face. It was less tension for me. I didn't stay there for long neither. Before a month I was getting called home on ED, and so I got out and went straight home and went residing at my auntie's house. And I had her bringing me drugs, and I wanted her too, and she said, "No you get back another habit, and you're going to be back out there." And I told her no I'm not I on the ban, I'm not going to cut this ban off. So I ended up completing it, and by me indulging in drugs still I had obtained another habit. The habit is when I needed it again and again every morning and everyday to function. So now I'm back on the west side of Chicago, back in the stores, caught another case and got out. So now I'm back on the streets selling drugs at this point it wasn't two days that had passed and the police drive on me and lock me up again. So I get a ban again, but this thing I don't complete, and so they have like bounty hunters and everything out looking for me. And I'm getting slick I said I go out at night so it's like I need more and more drugs to suffocate what I'm going through now. So I'm running and hiding from everybody and don't nobody want to be bothered because they know the police is looking for me. So, it was a hell of a life to live back then, this one girl she was very similar looking to me, and they had got her and locked her up. And I was like god, I felt kind of bad but it didn't bother me that much to turn myself in.

C- They thought she was you?

N- Yes and they took her. But after she went through the process I said they'll let her go, and everybody was mad and they said to go tell them and I said no I'm not. Finally, they catch up with me and in the process of them catching up with me I had like 5 grams maybe more.

C- How much is that?

N- I'm going to say $3,000.00 of heroine, I done figure out that I was going to dye my hair, and I'm shaking up the dye and I was going to change my whole look. And I had just got out the car with someone and they was telling me, "Sherry, they had searched my car looking for you." And I said they don't know where I'm at, and this one guy that I would always get him high so he can walk me through the neighborhood, because he had became friends with these people that had been looking for me, so I trusted him to take me through the neighborhood. Cause one time I was standing right there and they was like you seen her and he was like no. And that built my trust so I would give him money to get high and walk with him. And I'm sitting there in the basement and I got all this stuff in my breast I haven't put it anywhere and I hear somebody knocking at the door and I opened it, and I hadn't locked the gait. So they got guns out pointing them out at me, and now I'm devastated and I got all this stuff on me, and they said don't move. And they looking at a picture and saying this is her this is her. Coming in all crazy and I took it and I threw it, so they grabbed me they arrest me, not beat me, they roughen me up, and put me in the car, and they was like you going away for a long time. To me it counted more than what I had , we went over to the police station, I stayed there for like 24 hours, longer than what I usually stay in there for. And then they shipped me out to the county jail and at this point even though I was sick I wasn't even worried about that as much I usually do. I wasn't running up to the nurse and crying it was like and I was very in touch with my auntie then. My auntie she's criminal life all the way, and that's the source of how I would get my drugs, and how I would call home, because now it's just me, grandmother's passed, everybody that had raised me was older and had passed except for my aunt. I couldn't call her because she was fed up with me, so I would call my other aunt and I was telling her the case that I was trialed. And she was telling me don't take no time, and that's not how it's going to go, and you going to get out of there. I didn't basically say two I just said ok and I hung up the phone. As I go back and forth to court I'm having money, I'm very familiar with county now, so I'm able to go from tier to tier, mingle with the women. So a month and a half has passed and I'm going back to court, I'm going basically every week, and I never forget it. The judge pulls me in there , no first the representative because I didn't have a lawyer, he goes back and said they're going to offer you 13 you need to take it. And I was like I'm not taking no 13 years.

C- What's a representative?

N- He comes back there to defend he's not a lawyer. He comes back basically to tell you what are they going to offer you, public defender. What they are going to offer you what the judge is agreeing to do. And a lot of times if you just take it and bite it they're going to give it to you. So 13 I knew I couldn't do 13, so I figured if I had to I probably would've. The process moved on and my name was called out, and I went into the room, and I said they called this other guy to. So there's a man from out the street and me on there, he's sentencing both of us, and I'm freaking out. And I was like how is he going to sentence me and him at the same time. And I'm under an alias I'm not using my right name Keisha Streeter, cause I have so many different names. Cause from going in and out I think that's going to get me out. So he's saying Keisha Streeter bap bap bap 10 years real quick, so I just look.

C- So they got you for possession?

N- And intent to delivery, even though they didn't find it on me, they found it where I was at, and so many feet they had put it on me. Intent to deliver possession, and he's telling me ten years and I'm just standing there and water is running out my eyes. And I'm like ten years I thought I could've fainted, but once I got back.

C- How old were you?

N- I was like 1994, I don't keep up with the age, I'm 33 now, but I'm going to say 28. No, I had to had been 26.

(Salome in back drop calculating 23, Carol agreeing because it was ten years ago)

N- I called my auntie and I tell her I got ten years, and she's fussing at me why did you take the time and woo woo woo, I'm tired that's all I felt like, I'm tired. When I went down I knew the road how you go down strip and squat whatever, let's just do this I'm ready to go. She was like, "You didn't fight your case long enough you didn't do this." I was like whatever I'm ready to go.

C- How were you sentenced with this man, was he involved with your case?

N- No, he was coming from outside, I was incarcerated locked up in Cook County Jail, they pulled him out, and I was standing right there and they told him how much time he was sentenced to and told me.

C- Is that unusual?

N- That's very unusual. Very unusual.

C- So you were basically railroaded young girl, got a drug problem, no help, now you going to jail for ten years.

N- Exactly.

C- You had two children.

N- Didn't know nothing of task or rehabilitation services.

C- None of that was discussed, and you going to jail.

N- And I'm going to jail for ten years s I'm down there, when I first get there I'm not playing with the rules, I'm fighting a lot, a lot of anger. I'm mad because I got these ten years, and I had to deal with it, but after I had a confrontation with a police officer and I hurt the police officer, I was in Seg in Logan because I didn't want to be in there.

C- You had a fight with the police?

N- Yes.

C- You selling drugs in prison?

N- Yes that was later on, yes I did.

C- You using drugs?

N- No, I didn't use drugs, I was even brought drugs to use, and that's how I started selling drugs.

C- So you got ten years, you're 23 years old, you fighting the police, you rebelling. Any help?

N- No, still no help.

C- Psychological, psychiatry?

N- No the men in Seg that's it no psychological help. I was placed in Seg, across from me was men, and circuit riders and the one guy calls, when they come out there the board come, and read you off what you did and they talk to you real nasty. "Well you hurt one of our officer's you going to be in big trouble, so he's overhearing this, all the men are hearing this, so I go off to my cell and I'm reading off what I done did. He goes, "baby sister!", whistling.

C- This is one of the prisoners, you're locked up in Seg with men?

N- So he's calling over to me and saying, "You know." And he's an older guy too he's saying, "You know you're a pretty young girl and I know understand, but you can't make your bit like this." In so many words he was saying if you got ten years and five left to do you can't do it like this. So I sat there for like three more days and I would talk to him, and he would talk to me and I was shipped out. Shipped back to Dwight max and c-graded.

C- What does that mean?

N- C grade is where the commissary that I was talking about earlier you can't have it you can only get personals. You can only buy personals and so many packs of cigarettes, you have to figure out a way to get somebody else a personal so they can buy you a snack or something like that.

C- So treats, you couldn't get no treats?

N- No treats.

C- You were C and you were max, what does that mean?

N- Maximum security, security is always there. It's basically where you have to get popped in and out of your cell. Your locked in and if they don't want to pop the door open when the blinker is going off, you're locked in. And if they don't want to pop the door open when they see the blinker, you don't get out.

C- So this is your punishment for fighting an officer?

N- This is my punishment, shipment, seg time, max, and c-grade, I think I had c-grade for like a year.

C- So no goodies for a year, you could just buy deodorant?

N- Right, lotion and a few packs of cigarettes and this was like once a month you could only buy c-grade, whereas everybody else goes to commissary every week, once a month.

C- So, you're 23, got ten years, now you come in and now you get another punishment. You still crazy?

N- Still crazy, but by this time I want to be off from here, I don't want to be here, cause I'm around women that are constantly doing the same thing. Getting into trouble, fighting, hurting the officers, and throwing feces at the officers. So, I was like oh God I want to get out of this. And I the process of that I stayed out of trouble, I stayed in my room, I started reading, I don't read books a lot, I started reading, I had a good roommate though. I started reading, so I went from max to minimum. As soon as I made minimum I was shipped out again. They wanted to send me to Kankakee, but Kankakee had heard about me and they didn't want me.

C- Heard about you what?

N- My behavior in Logan, how I had acted they didn't want me. They shipped me to Dixon, and I went to Dixon a lot of friends I knew from being prior locked up, was there and give me what I need. I went to school, I start going to school.

C- Turning your life around.

N- I start turning my life around. Start saying that I don't want to go through this no more. I got Jesus four more years how am I going to do this? So I started going to school I wanted something different. And when I started at it I didn't stop. With the GED I was running around, help me do this, help me do that, and the women do help you. If you ask for help, one of them women may have life and won't go home, they are so educated. And they really start touching my heart, and I clung on to the women that was there, old timers they took to me and they would help me, and they would show me how to budget or whatever. I took the GED for the first time, first time tested first time, and I passed it. And I was way in the ceiling somewhere, and my roommate was like come down Naomi come down. Cause I was so amazed of how good it was my first time. I knew that I could do that, then I could do whatever they had for me, or that I wanted to do. So I kept going I didn't stop there, I start getting involved in cosmetology school, they had a cosmetology school there. But I was still getting transferred back and forth, so now I'm back in Dwight, but I still don't stop.

N- I'm thinking they're messing with me, they are trying to break my spirit. I'm back in Dwight I'm back on shipment again. So, still I get into beauty school because I have my GED now, I start working the snack shop. Snack shop is where when people come and visit they buy coupons, and you got a skating rink there with a whole bunch of snacks. I would work that, volunteer work. I had start working that, going to beauty school in the morning, working that in night. So, now I have a friend who's telling go to college. And I was like yeah I can go to college too, I can do that, anything to keep in the daze that is winding by. Talking to my kids more, they writing me letters now, and they coming to visit me now. Like two years done past, but now they coming back into my life. And it was so overwhelming I was so happy, and it was the beginning of a new life. To be rebonded with my kids, their family how they was going out to bring my kids to see me. And I didn't want to risk that anymore for nothing. So I was doing what I had to do. Before I didn't have that, I didn't have that.

(she takes a break because she starts crying)

C- So you changing your life around. So would you say that your encouragement was more from the women in prison? Did you get any help from the people?

N- No I didn't get any help. All my encouragement came from the women inside the prison.

C- The bad women?

N- The bad women, the good women, the ones that said that society.

C- I was being funny. The so-called bad women really did help you.

Salome- This has been a question on my mind, ever since you mentioned those women and your relationship, these women I'm thinking about the context in your relationship with your mom, aunt, and grandmother. And now you got these older women in your life. Can you talk about a couple experiences with the women?

N- There was this one lady I'm not going to say her name, but she was so inspirational to me, she was one that was not coming home today. She would tell me she would call me, " "little mama, little mama get over here, get over here, what you going to do today?" She would always ask me what I'm going to do, because they would always send me back. I went back to Dwight five times in five years, four years nine months. And I went back to Dwight at least three or four times, so it was like I was a circuit rider. Circuit rider is someone that travels from prison to prison. So she would always, and I would have to go through intake again, so she would always provide me with whatever I needed lotion, soaps, cigarettes. And some kind of way whatever unit she was on I always ended up with her. Grandbaby, that's what she use to call me, grandbaby come here, come here, and she'd do things with me like, things you wouldn't think we were doing. She would get me, and she would say stand up I'm going to teach you how to step, we be stepping, we be talking, we be playing games, things that we would share with each other. Some of our stories, my kids, I would tell her, different things. She was so encouraging for me at that point in life. I had a second chance, I had a second chance I need to get ahead. There was another women that she was so encouraging in school, she was so educated and had all these degrees, and yet they labeled her, labeled these women as like they were nothing. But they are so educated, they know so much, and she helped me in school. She encouraged me to go to school , do this, and do that. Helped me with my work, if I didn't know, if I had a problem I could sure enough take it to her, whatever she was doing she would sit down with me till I got it. They took time out it me with me, they took a lot of time out with me, and I would never forget that. Never forget that, and we say that, once I go home I'm going to write you, I'm going to keep in touch, that be our good intentions, it does it do. And even I have girlfriends that still go in and out, and always ask about these people that I talk about and ask how they doing, how such and such doing, what they doing. Never have I been back, or never have I really given back.

C- So you get on the right track, and you hear about Grace House tell us about that.

N- I think I was about three months short and I had girlfriend into it, I was telling her how I didn't have anywhere to go home. I didn't want to go back to my auntie's house because at this point I knew that if I go back into the same situation that wouldn't have a chance, or I probably wouldn't make it. So they had some information about Grace House and I had heard a few women talking about Leslie's place. So I went to the I think it was the social worker something, and told her I need to make a phone call, I need to get some information. So I think I had mail something to Grace House, I think I was two months short, maybe a one month short, and they said I wasn't going to make it, some of the negative women, "Cause you waited to late, you have to come down here and interview you, and see if they want to accept you." So, I'm thinking whatever I'm just going to leave it alone, and I never worried about it. I just did it, I filled out one for Grace House and Leslie's Place. So, one day I was on the yard, it was hot outside, and I was doing something, and the lady social worker called me and said you got a phone call. I'm thinking what done happen cause I done got a phone call my aunt done passed, my grandfather's real sick. I'm thinking my grandfather is passed, that's all I had, that's what's going to go now. But it wasn't, it was Rochelle from Grace House, the director from Grace House. And she's I got your information in front of me, basically telling me what she had in front of her , and asking me a few questions about me coming to Grace House, and some of the things that I might want to do. She was like we see you when you get here, this is the day that you come. And I would just start crying, and I would just goo gobin, I think I was just crying for the whole five years I was in there, because I didn't cry when I was in there. While I was in there I had to stay focus, at this point I was just broke, I was crying so hard. I ran back and told my room mate who was my girl. I told her that I was going to Grace House, and so before I hung up she was telling me how to get there, and to come in a cab. Don't go, I'm so paranoid and so it's my day, but before I go home I done went to seg or whatever but I get out the same day. We all in the bus we going I come with another lady and she's going to Grace House as well, and she's telling me on the way that her sister is going to come and pick us up. So we at the bus station and I'm just paranoid, I'm thinking that everybody walk by wants my little fifty dollars and hold of my box. And I'm scared to death, I'm scared. So her sister is not coming quick enough for me, I said I fonna catch the bus because they said you had to go straight to Grace House, I got to go, I got to leave you. Her sister end up coming right when I was going to get on a cab, cause I got a big old box, and I'm on my way to Grace House. And Grace House is on 51st and Bishop then. So I get there, we both get there, and we pack out, take the box in, and I'm feeling kind of nervous. And I'm looking at this big old house, fence, and going in there. And I come in and they're real welcoming you, the whole whatever I needed, and I just dropped the boxes, sit down, and I'm real quiet. So, before that day was over, Sister Kathy comes to me and says well you know you can't go out for a week. I'm like thank you Jesus, I don't want to go out no way. I'm too scared to go out right now. I stay in for my week. I call my babies come over, they bring my babies to come see me, it's a beautiful thing going on. I'm starting to get into groups, I'm starting to be active, in parenting, anger management, relationships, self-esteem, all that which I needed to build me back up. One on one sessions with Sister Kathy, who I love dearly. Naoma you in there, because I'm a late sleeper. She'll come, and she'll get me. She helped me through the issues.

C- Explain, who Sister Kathy is or what she does.

N- Sister Kathy is the counselor at Grace House, she does one on one groups with you, she was my counselor. They have different counselors, but Sis. Kathy was my counselor.

C- And she's your counselor for life?

N- Yes she is, I go over there right now for anything. Right now I'm getting involved into going to Northeastern. I'm calling, "Sis. Kathy, I want to go to school." However they can help me continues on and on. I love Grace House. I love Grace House. Grace House gave me a new beginning.

C- How long did you stay there?

N- I stayed at Grace House for more than I thought I needed to stay. I remember one time I was having group with Rochelle and she would get you. And I'm sitting in the group and I'm ready to go to work, and three or four months done passed, and everybody else moving on, and leaving out, and I'm still sitting. And I'm like I want a job, so I jumped up in the group she was like Naoma how you do this. I feel like I'm patient, tolerant, I should move on, I'm telling her all the things that I feel I've grown in and I can go. She said good now sit down, not yet. So right then I'm sitting impatient and tolerating, and I'm burning this steaming up, and patting, So I knew some more work need to be did. Instantly after I said all these things I was, she just pulled it right out of me. So I waited and I stayed never wanting to leave because the house was turning over, different women was coming in and out. But never once did I want to leave, the house would go in lock down. Lock down that was not in good form she didn't want us to use it, that's what I learned from prison, we would have restrictions, where we would have to stay and not go out. But still I would never stay, I never left where women would have to leave they couldn't handle that. I knew that this was something that I needed.

C- So you stayed at Grace House?

N- I stayed at Grace House.

C- You didn't have a roommate?

N- Oh when I first came, yes I had a roommate. I had a roommate and before long, not even a month, cause I always wanted my room, and I was use to being alone in my own room. And every time someone moved on and moved out they have a picking of the room. And I picked a number out and I ain't saying a word, and everybody is like no, no, no. And I waited and they said, "Naoma what you got?", and I said, "I got the room, the single room." So I had that room and I would go and come and start working and continuing to do my cosmetology license, because I didn't complete it when I was incarcerated. So I told Sister Kathy this is what I want to do, I want to start completing things. So I went on to Capri Beauty School, and Sister Kathy went with me. She made sure that paper work was right, she took time out, she went with me to the school. And everybody was looking at me, "Who's that, is that her mother?" Whatever, Sister Kathy didn't care, she went with me, she took out the time. And I had no problem telling the school teachers or whoever what was going on, so they accepted me and we went on. So before long, by this time I was able to work. So I told Sister Kathy I think I can handle a job, an evening job, a few hours. She said, " Ok, start looking don't rush yourself, but if you want you could start working. So I went right down the street from the school there was this McDonald's. I worked there for one week, but when I was there I had got a tag, my employees were so impressed they called me the happy cashier. I was the only one up there, "Hi, welcome to McDonald's." I was so grateful, "Welcome to McDonald's can I take your order." I went through all that. And it was just a process, a process, not even two weeks had passed and I had got another job through a girlfriend at Grace House at the hotel. And I started doing nights, doing turndowns, putting chocolates on the bed, simple stuff, giving fresh towels. So I'd leave school, go there, and come back home. So this means that I would be out late, pretty late, but I didn't care I would continue to do what I had to do. I knew I went out late doing nothing I had no business doing, so it was a good feeling. Before three months the manager of the hotel comes to me she was like, " You think you could handle being the supervisor over laundry, and making sure that the women clean the rooms, and checking behind the rooms." So I run back to Sister Kathy, " Sister Kathy do you know that they want me to do this, and they say I can do this." Even though I see myself doing this, sometimes I need a little push still today.

N- I became supervisor at the Arlington Crown Plaza, and I enjoyed that job. Soon back in school I had completed and graduated, and that was something that I thought would never happen. Because the hours had became so long to where I would start staying in school cause I was seeking the thousand points and you had to had 1500, that motivated me. I start going to school at nine and I would stay till nine at night. Especially if I didn't have to go to work I would stay there all day, do everybody's hair, do whatever I had to do. I wanted to complete this, I wanted to complete it. So I graduated.

C- Who was at your graduation?

N- Rochelle was there, Rochelle came, my babies came, there grandmother came.

C- So you looked out in the audience and there was some people?

N- Yes there was, it was a big old formal like backward dinner, and when they call us up on the stage Rochelle was like, she was over there crying, and my kids were crying too and helping me get my diploma. So it was a beautiful experience. So back at the hotel after I've accomplished this I was still working over there as supervisor. And part-time I had started working in the salon, and I really didn't want to do hair. So I thought I would do my friend's and my family hair which I still continue to do. But as far as the salon I just didn't have the feel for it right then, so I continued working at the hotel. And after that I wanted to be involved in something else, I figured I wanted to be involved with something that was evolved around my life experiences. I challenged myself and went to Hay Market again one of my girlfriends had came and I was doing her hair and they was telling me about Hay Market, and even through my addiction I never knew about Hay Market. So I went on to Hay Market and I had an interview with this beautiful lady named Ms. Cookie, and she told me how less it was but how much more she can give me. And that same day she said you got the job. And usually they'll call you or make you wait or something, she was telling me I had the job. I went and did my drop and I went through the process and everything. So I started, I never forget the day right after my birthday December 17th 2000. So I'm working there, and they call me and it was really experience because I was this med tech, you monitor the women and you give them their medication, and you do random drops on them. Because this is a residential treatment, but I'm working like on a second phase. Where they went through detox and they went through treatment, and now they're in a housing program. It's more like less structure, and the women are coming in and out and they're trying to tell you things, you know like let me use the phone and try to play you, whatever. Because I was so down to earth with them and I had experience a lot of things, even though I didn't disclose a lot of things I knew the behaviors.

So I could call them on it, and they became really bonded with me, and I had did very well. And a new program had opened up and my boss was like I want you to go to Hay Camp. And I was like ok, you know doors just continue to open for me right now today. So I went on to the new residential program which was a study on African-American women, to educate them on parenting, HIV, STDs, all that and just African-American women. And it was residential and they can bring their treatment involved in DCFS, we had the case manager.

C- They can bring their kids?

N- Yes, now we had beds for kids too and they would sleep with them in their room. And they would sleep with them, not in their bed, but in their own bed. I could remember listening to the women that would come on and do groups. They would come and they would educate them, I heard this one instructor she was talking about HIV and AIDS, and I was like dang I didn't know that, "and you can catch it through this and this", and that was very interesting. And I was thinking if I didn't know all that, who else didn't know that. So I would sit at my desk , even though I was doing my work I would be listening to her speak, so I went to her coordinator and I asked her about the field and all that was involved, and what would I have to do to be off into the field. So they had this take home study course, and they said take it home it's going to take you two or three months, take your time. Took it home that month I took the test and aced it. That month she was so impressed but still it was like they had everyone that they needed. And I was like if I just get me a chance they would realize that I can get in there and help them out and give them something of what I had. So they would send me to trainings, but I was still working at Hay Camp. I was going to trainings and I would tell my supervisor, cause we had switched over supervisors, and I would tell her and still do my hours, and extra over-time for her. So it came to a point, a position came open for an health ed outreach worker. It was like I was going to put in for that, so I go to my boss and she's like you know I don't like this but it's time for you to move on. She was like Naoma you've been such an asset to us, but I don't want to hold you back. So she put in for the transfer for me and I went on the interview, and I'm telling them what I have to offer and I get the job December 17th of this year- got the job. This job contained of going into the jails, going into the lock ups with the women, telling them about Hay Marcus something that I didn't know. And telling them about HIV and STDs and telling them how they can change their lives.

Whatever I felt I was able to freely walk in, somebody like me, pop the door let me in, got familiar with the officers in there, and they knew me coming, "Hey this is Naoma from Hay Market." They would let me in, go through the jails, I would walk through the jails, any tier, go to phase two.

C- Where you use to be locked up?

N- Where I use to be locked up. And it amazes me. And people would ask me, "How do you feel about that?" I said I like my job, I like it. Especially I would like it when my most gratifying experience is when while I was at Hay Market when two of the women would come to me and they would say well you know Naoma I want to come to Hay Market and I can go back and work for them. And before I knew it they would be at Hay Market remember me. And I would light up, that was my fulfillment, just to see the women actually come in, and make it in and get a chance to get education and get help, and get treatment. Cause Hay Market just offers a full range of treatment. By this point I'm working at Hay Market, I'm doing this every Tuesday and I'm connecting with Genesis House on Tuesday's and Wednesday's. I'm going to work for them and they're seeing me in my work, and they're you know have jobs there, and they're like you know you should come over here with us Naoma, you're really good. And I was like I'll think about it, so I never felt like because I needed more seasoning, so I said not yet. So I was going to trainings back to back, I went to 20 trainings since December up until last month. So I was trying to get educated and more seasoning, the feel of the feel. I think I got real confident in myself, and I thought it's time for me to move on it's time for me to move on. And I liked what Genesis House represented, first I got the information on Genesis house and what exactly it is they did, and the women that they service. What Genesis House is it's an organization that's been around since 1993, and they service women. Their main target is women involved in prostitution, but not just women involved in prostitution. We go into jails and we advocate for women involved in prostitution, because now it's a felony. We go into shelters we test for HIV and STDs. We on whole groups on prevention, goals, self-esteem, we try to encourage the women. We're basically a referral source and guess what Genesis House has old Grace House. I went there one day to pick up some of the women, I was so emotional. They had all went to the back, so I sat there and these tears were coming down and I patched it up before everybody came. It was just overwhelming, that's where I began and it was just a good thing for me. It was just amazing, and it still amazes me. So as of July 10th I've been working at Genesis House.

And Hay Market tried to keep me, it was a struggle, and they tried to make me a different position. I think I made the right move, and in January I'll be going to school at Northeastern, and gonna try to get a degree. I'm going to get a degree. With all the trainings I still have had problems trying to get grant money to go to school. Because drug offenses, drug offenders they're real limited to trying to give you money to go to school to educate you. But if I would've had a murder or aggravated battery I could've had money to go to school, but because of drug offense they're real limited. And I think I was kind of tired of battling with that, and I was getting discouraged. So I lacked back something, and one day I called Sister Kathy and I was telling her I'm going to go to school by the grace of God, they have a program through Northeastern and I have a mentor and everything, so in January I should be going to school. Got my little six pages on my disk, I'm working on it. I'm really grateful to Grace House, I'm just grateful, it's just been really a long haul, but I don't think I would change anything. I think that I would change the system, because Sister Kathy came and she said why don't you go into criminal justice. That's what she wants me to major in, I'm like I can't do that I can't do that. Because still sometimes in my mind I think I put myself like they do, put me in a little box, I can accomplish so much because I have this and this behind me. I'm learning that if I strive that I can do whatever I want to do.

(They just thank each other for the experience)

Interviews